Yarnell Hill Fire Serious Accident Investigation Report Supporting Documentation

Comments

1. WantsToKnowTheTruth says

   October 12, 2015 at 1:50 am

   **
   ** WHO WAS REALLY DRIVING THE CYFD PICKUP WITH THE CAMPER TOP?
   ** GARY CORDES… OR COUGAN CAROTHERS?
   **
   ** DISCUSSION CONTINUED…

   >> On October 11, 2015 at 12:54 pm, Marti Reed said…
   >>
   >> I’m not feeling as “done” as you are with this. And I’m just waking up after something
   >> of a rough night. But one of the reasons I’m not feeling as “done” as you are is that I
   >> never was able to be “done” with it, as hard as I tried. I really hated (and still do)
   >> working on this endless rabbit (at least it was a rabbit hole for me) that I worked on
   >> for endless amounts of time until I just finally got sick of doing it and moved on to
   >> where everybody else was at.

   I understand… but I think if we just forget about all the ‘who’s who’ in the photographs from later in the day for a moment and just focus on this ONE issue of WHO was really driving that CYFD Red-with-white-stripes pickup WITH the camper top ( Cordes or Carothers? )

   I believe we CAN either nail it down… OR relegate it to the “until there is more evidence we just can’t be sure” category.

   And I think it’s important to do that.. once and for all.

   So the question is… IS there some piece of evidence which would establish, for sure and certain… WHO was driving the CYFD command vehicle with the camper top that day?

   I still believe there IS… and ( once again ) it would be because Joy Collura was in the right place, at the right time, and doing the right thing that Sunday, June 30, 2013.

   She was ‘documenting’ what was happening that day… AS it was happening.

   The images that Joy Collura freely and transparently shared with the SAIT investigators ended up in their own special folder in the SAIT documentation… and that folder is still HERE…

   https://www.dropbox.com/sh/02ue6bnjp6nazkm/AAAQHmeW4AtE4acHagKGrrcSa/Photos%20and%20Video/Hiker%20Photos%20Videos/Reduced%20Photo%20Images?dl=0

   In that folder there are TWO images that CLEARLY show this CYFD command vehicle WITH the camper top installed ‘out there’ in the Sesame area in what ( I believe ) is DEFINITELY a ‘morning’ ( as in… before NOON ) timeframe.

   The were both in the same ‘grouping’ of photos that includes the ones showing the Blue Ridge vehicles first ‘arriving’ in the Sesame area… and we know now for sure and certain that was in the 10:30 AM range… almost 2 hours before Rance Marquez and Cougan Carothers would ever set foot out in that Sesame area that day.

   So any kind of ‘before NOON’ timeframe for these photos can ONLY mean that it was Gary Cordes who was driving that CYFD command vehicle WITH the camper top installed that day.

   Probably the most definite of the two would be the image in that folde named…

   “1 (40).JPG” ( 8th row down, 3rd from the left ).

   This photo of Joy Collura’s seems to be showing that moment when Gary Cordes says he instructed the dozer operator to ‘put a ring’ around the Granite Mountain Superintendent and Chase trucks, which were parked at the top end of the Sesame area where that east-west two track that the Granite Mountain Hotshots used to hike up to the ridge that day begins heading WEST there at the top of the Sesame area.

   Gary Cordes was ‘out there’ at that time in the morning… and this was definitely a MORNING event… long before Rance Marquez and Cougan Carothers ever showed up in the Sesame area.

   On the left side of the photo is the Red-with-white-stripes CYFD command vehicle that DOES have the ‘camper top’ installed.

   So IF that photo really was taken in the MORNING timeframe… then it would appear to be proof ( positive ) that Gary Cordes was driving the CYFD pickup WITH the camper top.

   The SECOND image that appears to establish that Gary Cordes was driving that CYFD pickup WITH the camper top would be the image named…

   “1 (25).JPG” ( 5th row down, 4th image from the left ).

   This is that photo of Joy Collura’s that show 3 vehicles out on one of the two-track roads in the Sesame area… and it was ALSO taken in what appears to be the same MORNING ( as in… before NOON ) timeframe… and from the same ‘vantage point’ out on the ridge as the other photos in this ‘grouping’.

   From left to right the vehicles shown are…

   The Dozer, the CYFD Red-with-white-stripes command vehicle WITH the camper top, and then one of the Blue Ridge Hotshot’s Chase trucks.

   An FF with a yellow Nomex shirt and a WHITE helmet is standing in front of the CYFD command vehicle and appears to be gesturing/talking to someone to the left, near the dozer. He LOOKS like he definitely could be Gary Cordes. ( Same height, build, and the WHITE helmet… etc. ).

   Given the (apparent) MORNING timeframe for this photo… it could still assumed this is Gary Cordes seen standing in front of that CYFD command vehicle and the reason the Blue Ridge Chase Truck is there is because this is the moment that Blue Ridge Hotshot Cory Ball had just been driven out there to take over the DOZB/HEQB job from Cordes.

   Again ( as with photo “1 (40).JPG” )… all that has to be proven is that either one ( or BOTH ) of these photos were taken BEFORE NOON… and they would BOTH represent proof that Gary Cordes was driving the CYFD pickup WITH the camper top installed that day.

   Actually… this gets very simple.

   Joy… are you reading this?

   You don’t have to remember the EXACT time these two photos were taken… but do you remember whether it was definitely in the MORNING ( as in… before NOON )?

   If the answer is YES… then both of these photos prove it was Gary Cordes driving the pickup WITH the camper top installed.

   No matter where this discussion goes from this point… I’m still going to need a ‘talk down’ and/or an explanation as to how Cougan Carothers could have been ‘out there’ in the Sesame area in the same ( morning ) timeframe as when these photos were ( apparently ) taken.

   Reply

   • WantsToKnowTheTruth says

     October 12, 2015 at 10:45 am

     NOTE: The comment above is ‘misplaced’. It is actually part of ‘Chapter XVI ( 16 )’ of the ongoing discussion about the Yarnell Hill Fire.

     The actual location of that ‘Chapter XVI’ discussion regarding vehicles is HERE…

     http://www.investigativemedia.com/yarnell-hill-fire-chapter-xvi/#comment-311432

     Reply

   • Charlie says

     January 16, 2019 at 1:48 pm

     WTKTT–I was with Joy and yes the time line was in the area of 10 am That dozer was doing line there at that time as well. Somewhere between 10 and 11 am — Joy had times on the photos but seems the camera was not set for time so somehow was off on the real time

     Reply

2. WantsToKnowTheTruth says

   February 1, 2014 at 1:39 pm

   Mr. Dougherty…

   First and foremost… THANK YOU for making this information public.

   It is quite obvious what a tremendous technical effort it has taken for you
   to make ALL of the material above available to everyone. Kudos.

   Important question, though.

   Do you still have any plans to release any of the “Aerial Firefighting Study”
   videos… either in full or part?

   There are already TWO of those videos that are known to contain
   background radio captures between Eric Marsh, Jesse Steed, and
   various members of the ‘fire command’ in the critical timeframe when
   the SAIR says there were “no communications with the crew”.

   One contains a full conversation between ASM2 and ground with
   concern about GM’s and DIVSA’s ( Marsh’s ) whereabouts at
   4:16… followed by two calls from fire command directly to “Granite
   Mountain” to verify their status and whether Marsh is ‘with them’.

   That is the only one that has been published publicy so far.

   The other one reportedly has a capture of OPS2 Paul Musser calling
   DIVSA Eric Marsh. This could be the ( now documented ) moment
   when Paul Musser was asking Eric Marsh if he could ‘spare resources’
   to help protect Yarnell.

   THAT video has been referenced extensively by others who have personal
   access to that video… but it has never been made public.

   Do you have any plans to at least publish THAT particular video/audio?

   Reply

3. John says

   January 21, 2014 at 3:38 pm

   John,

   Any chance we can see the link for the Helms Ranch One Hour Block Video? That ranch and the residents have to have significant clues and information on what happened that day.

   Reply

4. calvin says

   January 15, 2014 at 8:52 am

   Mr Dougherty or Elizabeth… Is the video tracking the BR superintendent or the BR captain’s movement? Many thanks for all your efforts

   Reply

   • John Dougherty says

     January 15, 2014 at 12:28 pm

     According to the notes attached to the file, the video was taken from the Blue Ridge Captain’s GPS unit.

     Reply